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dregad | moo | 15:57 |
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dregad | Paul_46 still awake ? | 15:58 |
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Paul_46 | moo | 16:10 |
dregad | hey | 16:10 |
Paul_46 | lo | 16:10 |
Paul_46 | Microsoft is taking the rare step of suing Google directly for something, tacking it onto a lawsuit against Motorola Mobility over Google Maps. | 16:11 |
Paul_46 | ohhh | 16:11 |
Paul_46 | MS vs google :P | 16:11 |
dregad | hmm nice | 16:11 |
dregad | after Apple vs Samsung | 16:11 |
dregad | and | 16:11 |
Paul_46 | If Google is found guilty over Google Maps, it may have to either pull Android phones using the Maps or pull the app off its partners' smartphones. | 16:11 |
dregad | Oracle vs rest of the world ;) | 16:11 |
Paul_46 | applve vs samsung is still going on :) | 16:12 |
dregad | if these companies spent less on lawsuits, we'd have cheaper and better products | 16:12 |
Paul_46 | well it is getting a bit silly | 16:13 |
dregad | a *bit* ? :P | 16:13 |
Paul_46 | :) | 16:13 |
Paul_46 | well | 16:13 |
Paul_46 | it's like a game | 16:13 |
Paul_46 | "I have 50 20 year old patents before mobiles existed" | 16:13 |
Paul_46 | i'm gonna find reasons why my patents infringe on your mobile | 16:13 |
Paul_46 | and if my 50 patents don't infringe | 16:14 |
Paul_46 | i'll go buy some other companies patent portfolio | 16:14 |
Paul_46 | and evalute if they infringe :0 | 16:14 |
dregad | it's all WIPO's fault ;) | 16:15 |
Paul_46 | it is a hard one though | 16:15 |
Paul_46 | not quite sure how they'll get out of it :) | 16:16 |
Paul_46 | although I do think the samsung+apple judge had best idea | 16:18 |
Paul_46 | limit them to 100 hours or whatever it was ;p | 16:18 |
Paul_46 | anyway | 16:21 |
Paul_46 | what do we do with our next branches | 16:22 |
dhx1 | Paul_46, hey, sorry I've missed you | 16:22 |
Paul_46 | ;/ | 16:22 |
dhx1 | ... as in, missed your conversations haha :) | 16:22 |
dhx1 | wait... this isn't getting better... | 16:22 |
* Paul_46 ponders | 16:23 | |
dhx1 | haha | 16:23 |
dhx1 | I had a peek at your 2.0 branch | 16:23 |
Paul_46 | i'm almost done adding exception classes ;p | 16:23 |
dhx1 | is it similar to 'next'? | 16:23 |
Paul_46 | 'similar' | 16:23 |
Paul_46 | i think we need fewer exceptions | 16:24 |
Paul_46 | *still think | 16:24 |
Paul_46 | i'm trying to get to point where phpdoc/spelling/code analysis type tools i run dont show lots of error | 16:25 |
dhx1 | we need enough exceptions that you can catch specific types of exceptions higher up without overlap/ambiquity | 16:25 |
* Paul_46 nods | 16:26 | |
Paul_46 | what i mean is there's some cases where we should have 1 | 16:26 |
Paul_46 | e.g. | 16:26 |
Paul_46 | if we have an php_extension_ldap_not_found and a phpextension_curl_not_found | 16:26 |
Paul_46 | should have a PHPExtensionNotFound exception that covers both | 16:27 |
dhx1 | yes | 16:28 |
dregad | now that the 2 of you are chatting, you are forbidden to quit until you agree on what to keep, next or 2.0 ;-) | 16:30 |
dhx1 | haha | 16:32 |
dhx1 | I'm actually going to say that we should manually merge in small chunks of functionality to the 'master' branch once we agree on approaches | 16:33 |
Paul_46 | i think we should aim for a mantis 2.0 beta for end of month | 16:33 |
Paul_46 | :) | 16:33 |
dhx1 | it's not really 2.0 though | 16:33 |
dhx1 | well... it kind of is | 16:33 |
Paul_46 | the 2.0 reflects the fact we'll add a mobile interface | 16:33 |
Paul_46 | and ideally a new webservice api | 16:34 |
dhx1 | but it doesn't offer anything to users afaik | 16:34 |
Paul_46 | and from practical purposes that the db layer changed so plugins are likely [will] need updating | 16:35 |
dhx1 | yes, and error_api died | 16:35 |
Paul_46 | we should go through the commits to master since we started work on next/2.x/whatever | 16:36 |
Paul_46 | and work out what makes sense to port | 16:36 |
dhx1 | we will need to ensure that translatewiki is all setup to work with the new branch as well | 16:36 |
Paul_46 | as whilst most commits have been fine, some have been quite shocking | 16:36 |
Paul_46 | and should be reverted imo | 16:36 |
dhx1 | before any alpha/beta version is released | 16:36 |
Paul_46 | [09:06.30] <Paul_46> you stopped coming in mantis irc channels? | 16:36 |
Paul_46 | [09:06.43] <siebrand> apparently... | 16:36 |
Paul_46 | [09:06.54] <siebrand> Must have gotten out of my channel list.. | 16:36 |
Paul_46 | [09:07.21] <siebrand> I'm not using the product anymore, so less interest… Also very little time lately… My work at Wikipediais all consuming. | 16:36 |
Paul_46 | [09:07.36] <Paul_46> when did you stop using it? | 16:36 |
Paul_46 | [09:07.59] <siebrand> 18 months or so ago. | 16:36 |
Paul_46 | [09:08.16] <Paul_46> you've still done translation commits tohugh | 16:37 |
Paul_46 | [09:08.23] <siebrand> of course. | 16:37 |
Paul_46 | [09:08.40] <siebrand> but I'm not really invested in the code base anymore. | 16:37 |
Paul_46 | [09:09.08] <siebrand> I know there's some i18n stuff that should be done for 1.3, but I'm not sure if 1.3 is "real" at themoment. | 16:37 |
Paul_46 | (FYI) | 16:37 |
dhx1 | yes I know, I had a long chat a few months ago | 16:37 |
dhx1 | it's our responsibility to do the i18n work for MantisBT | 16:37 |
Paul_46 | in english | 16:38 |
dhx1 | we have to write all the code for TranslateWiki to support new versions of MantisBT | 16:38 |
dhx1 | ... noting there are numerous open source reference implementations that can be copied (more or less) | 16:39 |
dregad | Paul_46: the next/2.0 version needs to bring some incentive for users to upgrade | 16:39 |
dregad | otherwise it will just be an exercise of programming | 16:40 |
dregad | and people will stay on 1.2 | 16:40 |
dhx1 | yep | 16:40 |
* Paul_46 nods | 16:41 | |
Paul_46 | well if we put a mobile web interface in the box | 16:41 |
Paul_46 | and replace the nusoap layer with a webservice layer supporting more then just soap | 16:42 |
Paul_46 | as well as trying to modernize some of the code | 16:42 |
Paul_46 | and fixing the pgsql/mssql support that's currently broken | 16:42 |
Paul_46 | one's starting to get | 16:42 |
Paul_46 | a) some incentives to update | 16:43 |
Paul_46 | b) a base for future releases | 16:43 |
dregad | mobile web, ok maybe for a limited number of ppl | 16:43 |
dregad | nusoap, idem | 16:43 |
Paul_46 | idem? | 16:43 |
dregad | modern code, users don't give a shit | 16:43 |
dregad | idem = same | 16:43 |
dregad | that's latin | 16:43 |
Paul_46 | ahh | 16:43 |
dregad | pgsql/mssql should be fixed with adodb 5.18 | 16:44 |
Paul_46 | nah | 16:44 |
Paul_46 | the current layer is broken in various ways | 16:44 |
dregad | mostly yes | 16:44 |
dregad | it's not perfect, but it works | 16:44 |
dregad | and the fact that you're breaking all plugins is a show stopper for a lot of ppl | 16:45 |
Paul_46 | i'd port a bunch of plugins tbh | 16:45 |
Paul_46 | trying to fix pgsql/mssql in 1.2 is just unfair to users tbh | 16:45 |
Paul_46 | we should admit its broken | 16:46 |
Paul_46 | get a schema that works in pgsql/mssql that we are happy with | 16:46 |
Paul_46 | and start from scratch with pgsq/mssql | 16:46 |
Paul_46 | [the only mantis instances I run use mssql and i'm saying this] | 16:47 |
dregad | funny, today while investigating an issue with John's snippet plugin, I stumbled upon this blog post http://noswap.com/blog/on-the-inelegance-of-php/ | 16:48 |
Paul_46 | you've even done 'fixes' for mssql that would break my setup of mssql+mantis at work to fix issues in mssql | 16:48 |
dregad | lol | 16:49 |
dregad | I don't recall ever making fixes for mssql | 16:49 |
dregad | pgsql yes | 16:49 |
jreese | dregad: foreshadowing on the order of a few years, eh? :P | 16:49 |
Paul_46 | you did one other week iirc | 16:49 |
dregad | jreese - exactly | 16:49 |
dregad | Paul_46 if you're referring to http://www.mantisbt.org/bugs/view.php?id=14774 i just applied a pull request from a user | 16:51 |
Paul_46 | I want to get back to the point where we have a tested build of mantisbt with mssql I can run out of box at work | 16:51 |
Paul_46 | having concluded two years ago that the adodb layer is broken | 16:52 |
Paul_46 | that means i want a release of 'next'/'2.0x'/whatever you want to call it between now and december | 16:52 |
Paul_46 | at least in alpha form for that db layer | 16:52 |
dregad | i'm all for that | 16:53 |
Paul_46 | now to be fair, i'll probably just make that 'alpha' form ==> automated build of master-2.0.x branch for my work purposes | 16:53 |
dregad | but don't expect users to come running to the new version | 16:53 |
* Paul_46 nods | 16:54 | |
Paul_46 | in any case though, we are being unfair to users atm | 16:55 |
dregad | in what way ? | 16:55 |
Paul_46 | well, it's always been our policy not to add new features into 1.2 | 16:55 |
Paul_46 | [a released branch] | 16:56 |
Paul_46 | atm, we seem to be doing that | 16:56 |
dregad | we've been through this several times already | 16:56 |
dregad | and you know exactly why this is happening | 16:56 |
Paul_46 | well it's just generating work for us | 16:56 |
dregad | for me, you mean | 16:57 |
dregad | double commits for each change | 16:57 |
Paul_46 | well | 16:57 |
dregad | makes my stats at ohloh look good ;) | 16:57 |
Paul_46 | could need to commit those to 2.x too | 16:57 |
dregad | i'm not gonna do that until a decision's been taken | 16:58 |
Paul_46 | i need to go through all commits to 1.2 and 1.3 | 16:58 |
Paul_46 | and send a mail about each one about forward porting | 16:58 |
dregad | no you dont | 16:58 |
dregad | only 1.3 | 16:58 |
Paul_46 | and a mail to list about each one i think needs reverting | 16:58 |
Paul_46 | :) | 16:58 |
Paul_46 | no - as there's stuff that went into 1.2 but not 1.3 | 16:58 |
dregad | not by me | 16:58 |
Paul_46 | and then we released the 1.2 stuff to users | 16:58 |
Paul_46 | really smart :) | 16:58 |
dregad | well | 16:59 |
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dregad | time for bed | 17:05 |
dregad | remember, Paul_46 you are not allowed to leave this chat until you've agreed with dhx1 on which branch to keep ;) | 17:06 |
Paul_46 | that's easy | 17:06 |
Paul_46 | whichever is less work | 17:07 |
dregad | i'll check the log transcript tomorrow morning to find out the answer then ;) | 17:07 |
dregad | good night | 17:07 |
dhx1 | cya | 17:08 |
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Paul_46 | so | 17:09 |
GitHub23 | [mantisbt] grangeway pushed 1 new commit to master-2.0.x: http://git.io/Uv0UXQ | 17:11 |
GitHub23 | [mantisbt/master-2.0.x] Additional Exceptions - Paul Richards | 17:11 |
Paul_46 | dhx1: need sleep soon | 17:12 |
dhx1 | Paul_46, ok | 17:12 |
Paul_46 | but yea | 17:14 |
Paul_46 | what is the plan? :P | 17:14 |
dhx1 | ummm | 17:16 |
dhx1 | we go through both 'next' and 'master-2.0.x' together | 17:17 |
dhx1 | and redo changes we think are worthwhile to keep | 17:17 |
dhx1 | (committing to the current master branch) | 17:17 |
dhx1 | perhaps...? | 17:17 |
Paul_46 | there's stuff in the current master branch I dont think we should keep | 17:17 |
dhx1 | but then again, I kind of reached the point with database work where I decided that the whole schema needs reworking | 17:18 |
dhx1 | transactional support, constraints, views, etc... | 17:18 |
Paul_46 | the other option would be to conclude that mantis is 'dead' | 17:18 |
dhx1 | Paul_46, make a list | 17:18 |
Paul_46 | there's been around ~300 commits to master-2.0.x since we branched it | 17:21 |
dhx1 | 400 to next ;) | 17:21 |
Paul_46 | tbh probably the quickest thing to do would be to set github back to where we branched out | 17:23 |
Paul_46 | get a list of diff's for each branch | 17:23 |
Paul_46 | and go through them 1 at a time | 17:23 |
dhx1 | that's what I just said :P | 17:23 |
Paul_46 | i mean | 17:24 |
Paul_46 | master as well | 17:24 |
dhx1 | master is what it is | 17:24 |
dhx1 | we can't really decide to just drop it now | 17:24 |
dhx1 | we could revert certain commits/functionality but that is still going to be quite problematic | 17:24 |
dhx1 | it's probably best to just rewrite on top of master | 17:24 |
Paul_46 | why couldn't we dorop it? | 17:24 |
dhx1 | given how much code will churn anyway (error_api, lang_api, database_api, etc) | 17:25 |
Paul_46 | that's gonna break more | 17:25 |
Paul_46 | it doesn't help that some people have been doing whitespace commits recently in master | 17:27 |
GitHub177 | [mantisbt] grangeway pushed 1 new commit to master-2.0.x: http://git.io/SkI2Wg | 17:32 |
GitHub177 | [mantisbt/master-2.0.x] The warning message displayed by user_get_field() when called with user - Paul Richards | 17:32 |
GitHub38 | [mantisbt] grangeway pushed 1 new commit to master-2.0.x: http://git.io/EHhigg | 17:34 |
GitHub38 | [mantisbt/master-2.0.x] Fix comment - Paul Richards | 17:34 |
Paul_46 | https://github.com/mantisbt/mantisbt/commit/34e71865bf17763f22d6787e0a832ae6eec405e6 | 17:37 |
Paul_46 | dhx1: can't even cherry pick that without a merge conflict | 17:37 |
Paul_46 | dhx1: is it just git push in this case ;/ | 17:39 |
GitHub52 | [mantisbt] grangeway pushed 1 new commit to master-2.0.x: http://git.io/KpZUpg | 17:41 |
GitHub52 | [mantisbt/master-2.0.x] Change Log must consistently rely on fixed_in_version - Paul Richards | 17:41 |
GitHub59 | [mantisbt] grangeway pushed 1 new commit to master-2.0.x: http://git.io/LZNJ6w | 17:51 |
GitHub59 | [mantisbt/master-2.0.x] ReAuthor 791fbd93d09b4b5b3f272413e5396d280735dc51 - Paul Richards | 17:51 |
Paul_46 | nn | 17:53 |
Paul_46 | dhx: btw, the changes aren't mergeable | 17:53 |
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